Are Virtual Blackjack Machines Rigged
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Jan 04, 2019 No, the machines are not rigged, the word “rigged' has such negative connotations. Is there a house advantage? Yes, the set of rules governing blackjack create a small, built-in house advantage, whether the game is live or virtual. These rules may be tweaked a tiny bit to very slightly raise or lower the percentages.
Croupier
Croupier is right
Looks like there is a first time for everything :D
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DJTeddyBear
Croupier is right -- the virtual BJ machines in Pennsylvania deal from separate shoes for each player and the dealer.
I don't think that's isolated to Pennsylvania.I'm under the understanding that ShuffleMaster's TableMaster machines does that for ALL games that can use multiple decks, and in all jurisdictions.
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁 Note that the same could be said for Religion. I.E. Religion is nothing more than organized superstition. 🤗
FleaStiff
A good deal of your post relates to what is a perception regarding the dealers actions and facial expressions. This is not evidence, the dealers are bored and often have fixed expressions in place.
I think you might want to rephrase the question as: Assuming that rigging the shoe is indeed going to work, how long would it take to rig it and how much additional money would be made for the time and effort the casino invested in that cheating.
Normally a casino has no need to cheat. Normally a casino manager is worried about losing a license if there is ongoing pervasive cheating.
In an Indian casino there is usually no fear about losing a license. Still there is no need for it to cheat, they just change the payout. With this mandated ante to play and a 6:5 payout, I sure don't see how you could really expect to win.
So on balance I'd say, its probably not rigged simply because its not worth their time and effort to do such a thing. Indian casinos are not noted for being cash cows for the players, they are noted for being cash cows for the tribes. I don't think anyone would play at an Indian casino if they happened to have an alternative that was close to them. Whether this one particular casino has a reputation or not, I don't know but your response should simply be to save up your money and go to Vegas where the exact same financial results may occur but you will not have the slightest worries about the fairness involved. It may not be a comfort to your wallet but it will be a comfort to your peace of mind.
Indian casinos often declare a slot machine jackpot to be a malfunction and the player has no recourse. If it happens in Vegas, you at least get an armed Gaming Officer and a right to a hearing. Thats the difference between a state being worried about its primary industry and a Tribe that has no worries about anything at all.
I think you might want to rephrase the question as: Assuming that rigging the shoe is indeed going to work, how long would it take to rig it and how much additional money would be made for the time and effort the casino invested in that cheating.
Normally a casino has no need to cheat. Normally a casino manager is worried about losing a license if there is ongoing pervasive cheating.
In an Indian casino there is usually no fear about losing a license. Still there is no need for it to cheat, they just change the payout. With this mandated ante to play and a 6:5 payout, I sure don't see how you could really expect to win.
So on balance I'd say, its probably not rigged simply because its not worth their time and effort to do such a thing. Indian casinos are not noted for being cash cows for the players, they are noted for being cash cows for the tribes. I don't think anyone would play at an Indian casino if they happened to have an alternative that was close to them. Whether this one particular casino has a reputation or not, I don't know but your response should simply be to save up your money and go to Vegas where the exact same financial results may occur but you will not have the slightest worries about the fairness involved. It may not be a comfort to your wallet but it will be a comfort to your peace of mind.
Indian casinos often declare a slot machine jackpot to be a malfunction and the player has no recourse. If it happens in Vegas, you at least get an armed Gaming Officer and a right to a hearing. Thats the difference between a state being worried about its primary industry and a Tribe that has no worries about anything at all.
WizardofEngland
Forgive my ignorance, but why is the there no fear of losing a licence in an Indian casino? I recently stayed at the Seminole Hard Rock in Florida, and noticed no difference between an indian casino and a traditional casino. I wasn't sure what to expect, but all was normal.
http://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/general/10042-woes-black-sheep-game-ii/#post151727
Are Virtual Blackjack Machines Rigged For Sale
DJTeddyBear
Forgive my ignorance, but why is the there no fear of losing a licence in an Indian casino?
Every time I see a statement like that, I wonder the same thing.I'm assuming that, unlike state licensed casinos, there is no outside authority available to oversee and/or settle dispites. There generally IS a self-appointed authority, but the feeling is, who do you think they will side with? And even if something is uncovered, who do you think they will report it to?
For the record, I don't believe any of it. I gotta believe that they have to answer to someone. Maybe not on the state level. Maybe on the federal level, but there's got to be some form of oversight.
Quote: WizardofEngland
I recently stayed at the Seminole Hard Rock in Florida, and noticed no difference between an indian casino and a traditional casino. I wasn't sure what to expect, but all was normal.
I think even if the allegations were true, to a casual observer, you'd never notice anything different - except that the decor may have an Indian theme.Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁 Note that the same could be said for Religion. I.E. Religion is nothing more than organized superstition. 🤗
WizardofEngland
Not really an indian theme, just guitars and music related stuff everywhere. for some reason?http://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/general/10042-woes-black-sheep-game-ii/#post151727
DJTeddyBear
Seminole may be Indian owned, and on soverign Indian land, but it's managed by, themed as, and named, Hard Rock.Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁 Note that the same could be said for Religion. I.E. Religion is nothing more than organized superstition. 🤗
WizardofEngland
I believe the casino in question is just outside the indian land, but with the amount of money the seminole's have, they can pretty much buy ANYTHING. I believe they loaned the state of Florida $1BN in return for legalized blackjack. They say roulette there is a matter of time.http://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/general/10042-woes-black-sheep-game-ii/#post151727
FleaStiff
Forgive my ignorance, but why is the there no fear of losing a licence in an Indian casino?
Some Indian tribes are mere concoctions by lawyers, some Indian tribes are more cults than tribes. The main thing is that usually the licensing authority is a rubber-stamp entity created by the tribe itself. Some Indian tribes have tremendous political clout and economic clout.>I recently stayed at the Seminole Hard Rock in Florida, and noticed no difference between an indian casino and a traditional casino.
You didn't notice any craps or roulette, you didn't notice any significant Comps being awarded, you were in what was essentially a monopoly and therefore not required to be responsive to customers who have complaints.WizardofEngland
I did get my whole bill comped for the stay though, meals, drink and mini bar, was circa $1,800. Not to shabby I think.http://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/general/10042-woes-black-sheep-game-ii/#post151727
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3102yuma
Virtual Blackjack Machines Strategy
I have made my last trip to Winstar Casino in Thackerville in Oklahoma. I have played blackjack for 30 years all over the country, but never at the Indian Casinos. I have won and lost, and admit to being somewhat of a sore loser. I have come to the conclusion you simply cannot win there. When I sit at a table, eventually everybody ends up disgusted from losing over and over and leave. It seems like know one wins. I wander if there are any former pit bosses from Vegas that work there and through their years of experience can see that something is just not right. It is uncanny how many blackjacks, aces up in a row that the dealers get. They crack me up when they put on what seems to be an act that they are so suprised by all their blackjacks, standing 20's, and hitting and not busting. I wish I had kept statistics on the percentage of hands I win. What I am sure of is that I can play 75-150 hands and maybe win three hands in a row during that stretch of playing. I can play 50 hands and never see a two-card 20 until the dealer has the samething. It does not matter if I am playing at a table with six decks or tables where they re-shuffle once they get through about two decks.
I cannnot go there and even play a leisurely game at the $5.00 minimum table. We just seem to lose and lose and lose. I want to repeat that I am a very experienced player, aware of bad streaks and the possibility of losing 10,15 or more hands in a row. But this is rediculous. I wrote the gaming commission, but I am already aware of the setup in Oklahoma and know it will fall upon deaf ears.
Could the machines be set up where once 'card-rich' hands that lean towards the house began to be shuffled into the machines in away that really increase the houses chance of winning. I play almost 99% by the mathmatics of the game.
i truly believe that one day it will be proven that somehow those shuffling machines are rigged.
Not one more .50 cent ante from me. I am done.
I cannnot go there and even play a leisurely game at the $5.00 minimum table. We just seem to lose and lose and lose. I want to repeat that I am a very experienced player, aware of bad streaks and the possibility of losing 10,15 or more hands in a row. But this is rediculous. I wrote the gaming commission, but I am already aware of the setup in Oklahoma and know it will fall upon deaf ears.
Could the machines be set up where once 'card-rich' hands that lean towards the house began to be shuffled into the machines in away that really increase the houses chance of winning. I play almost 99% by the mathmatics of the game.
i truly believe that one day it will be proven that somehow those shuffling machines are rigged.
Not one more .50 cent ante from me. I am done.
DJTeddyBear
Is it possible to rig the shuffler? Sure. Anything is 'possible'.Would they? My knee-jerk answer is 'no'.
It's easy enough for a casino to implement rules to give themselves a higher house edge, that to risk bad publicity and possible loss of their gambling license on a rigged shuffler.
Then again, if it's an Indian casino, even if caught, would they lose their license? Possibly not, which may increase the odds that they actually did it.
Superstitions are silly, childish, irrational rituals, born out of fear of the unknown. But how much does it cost to knock on wood? 😁 Note that the same could be said for Religion. I.E. Religion is nothing more than organized superstition. 🤗
odiousgambit
Virtual Blackjack Machines Odds
the machine would have to be rigged so that it feeds the right cards to just the dealer. That is quite an ambitious cheat seems to me.the next time Dame Fortune toys with your heart, your soul and your wallet, raise your glass and praise her thus: “Thanks for nothing, you cold-hearted, evil, damnable, nefarious, low-life, malicious monster from Hell!” She is, after all, stone deaf. ... Arnold Snyder
WizardofEngland
It is so unlikely, it can not be possible.First, the machines cost $1,000's to purchase, and you can never get the full spec on how they work. So even if you had your own technician, he would need to know exactly how the machine worked to be able to alter it. He could end up making a very expensive paperweight if he got it wrong.
Virtual Blackjack Online
Next, what logic do you give the shoe? Give all the players hard 17-20 and the dealer blackjack? Unlikely that sort of logic would work.Free Virtual Blackjack
Also the shoe outputs clumps of cards, so there is always a card ready to be drawn, you would need to plan in advance for it work, how many players are playing, how many boxes are open, what if a player leaves, splits tens, or doubles down on a hard 15?
All these make it so remote, its not even worth doing. The time and investment spent does not outweigh the gain, on a game that already makes money.
http://wizardofvegas.com/forum/off-topic/general/10042-woes-black-sheep-game-ii/#post151727
thlf
I worked at shufflemaster for several years. The shufflers are not nor can they be rigged. I had all of the internal passwords to set up the software, firmware, etc. and there is nothing there that can be altered to gain advantage either way. They are exactly as u see them.
thecesspit
I'd worry less about a shifty shuffler and more about a shifty deck of cards being fed in. Hold out a few cards from the deck and you could improve the house's chances.'Then you can admire the real gambler, who has neither eaten, slept, thought nor lived, he has so smarted under the scourge of his martingale, so suffered on the rack of his desire for a coup at trente-et-quarante' - Honore de Balzac, 1829
buzzpaff
You mention a 50 cent ante. Do you realize you will never beat that! 70 hands = $35 an hour in ante fees. The best any counter can expect is 1.5% profit. That includes ' George ' the greatest counter per Ken Uston. You would have to bet over $2300 per hour, count perflecthy and be able to spread your bets from 1 to 8 just to break even.
Are you paying a 50 cent ante, playing $5 BJ and somehow expecting to win ? If you are stay away from that firewater LOL
Are you paying a 50 cent ante, playing $5 BJ and somehow expecting to win ? If you are stay away from that firewater LOL
SOOPOO
Not one more .50 cent ante from me. I am done.
Help me out, forum. Is there a blackjack game where you have to pay a fee for the right to play the game? And people complain about 6:5?
In my wildest dreams I could not envision playing ONE hand where I had to pay an 'ante'. Yuma- it is possible you have had disproportionately bad hands, but if you are really paying an 'ante' you have NO CHANCE.
gofaster87
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Table Master Blackjack
Mosca
As soon as a player took a goofy hit, the whole rest of the shoe would be off. If you think they're cheating, hit a 19, and then you'll get all the other guy's cards.
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